What makes a mortgage company not only survive but thrive in a competitive industry? People, technology, and culture. In our upcoming LinkedIn Live episode of Lykken on Lending, we’re sitting down with Amy Smith, Chief Lending Officer at ALCOVA Mortgage, to explore how they’ve built a company where top talent stays, innovation drives efficiency, and community impact fuels growth. From their goal of 8-hour loan approvals to gamifying technology adoption, ALCOVA is redefining success in mortgage lending. Join us as we dive into their unique approach to leadership, culture, and cutting-edge automation
David: Listeners, it’s good to have you back with another Lykken on Lending podcast. Today, we’re interviewing Amy Smith, who is the Chief Lending Officer at Alcova Mortgage and what I’m trying to do with these interviews, listeners, is I want you to meet other companies and how do they run and what is unique about them. We’ve already had 3AM, the three owners of Alcova Mortgage, three owners. It’s Alcova Mortgage Initials, therefore 3AM. We’ve had them as guests already and we’ve talked numerous times and we’ve had them talking about themselves and how they are. But I thought it’d be good if we had Amy come on to talk about her experience as someone who’s been there for 10 years or just coming up on her 10th year anniversary to get her perspective and how this company runs. This is a special company and you say every company, especially that’s true, but this one is special from my perspective because they don’t lose people. People don’t move on and I think one of the big anxieties that everyone has today is we’re losing production people. I’m always in fear. I’m going to lose my production people to have a tendency not to leave this company. So we’re going to get in those insights from Amy today. And Amy, I just want to say, thank you so much for joining me. It’s so good to have you here.
Amy: Thank you so much, David. I’m happy to be here.
David: Good. I’m very excited to hear about your background a little bit. how did you originally come across Alcova mortgage?
Amy: Yes, so several years ago, I’ve been with them for 10 years, but prior to that, they were actually a customer of mine that sold loans to me. So I was an account executive and I was out prospecting and trying to build up new accounts and I sent an email to 1 of the owners about a hot new product that we had and I think he called my phone within two minutes of sending the email, which is typical of him. He likes new shiny toys.
David: Oh, that’s Bobby. That would have to be Bobby.
Amy: That’s exactly who it was. He called me very quickly. He’s this seems too good to be true. This can’t be real and we had a great conversation and I later drove to Roanoke and met with all three owners and just really so how unique they actually were.
David: Describe that first meeting because that’s, what I’m trying to do listeners is have you get insights into how other companies run. We have a lot of business owners that listened to this podcast, Amy and branch managers and want people that want to own a mortgage company and there is something special about every company you can say, cause we’re all unique and different, but there is something special about this company. What was it that impressed you in that first in person meeting with. Who we refer to as the three am the three owners of alcova mortgage
Amy: They were small at the time. They had just moved over into the correspondent world. I’m coming off of broker So it was an exception for me to make because they didn’t have the length, you know required that we needed and so I had to do an in person meeting with them, and it was a small office but the knowledge, the passion they had all their support staff in the office and I got to meet everyone. They were to me, I call them young. They were young guys at the time and just aggressive and I could tell they were passionate about the business and, instantly I’m like, I’ve got to give these guys a shot and we had a great relationship.
David: So that’s how it started. Then what made you want to move over? obviously the relationship developed and blooms from that standpoint, at some point in time, they came along and says, Amy, we’re tired of having you as our rep. We want you to be on our team. How what was that like?
Amy: I can tell you that when I did start doing business with them and I got to know them more, I had some of my other customers who were still on broker models, which was hard, right at the end of the mortgage crash in 2007 and 2008, we became heavily regulated, and several of my broker owners just wanted to become a net branch of somebody because they didn’t want the compliance responsibilities and I did send several of my top producing brokers over to Alcova. I had other companies I could have sent them to but I knew with these particular groups of people. I knew their families. I knew their wives, their children. I really cared about them and I knew they would align in the way they did business and the way they thought and just the whole character and so I did send them to Alcova and Bobby used to call me every year in December every year for about five years and say, what can I do to get you to come work for me? and my answer always was, what do you want me to do? And he’s I don’t know. I just want you to come work for me. So, he called at a right time, and I actually had a better offer from somebody else and the more I thought about it, I said I send everybody I care about to Alcova, like when somebody calls me and says, where should I go as a producer or a branch, I sent them to Alcova. So I said, it’s time for me to go there myself and be part of it.
David: And so glad you did because they have a deep respect for you and obviously it’s work because you’ve been there for 10 years coming up on your 10th anniversary in May. That’s amazing. When you start looking at it. One of the things that I want to get into is looking at what sets Alcova apart from your perspective and there’s many aspects. First of all, one of the things that I’m, when I went through and I said, now give me the date of hire from all these people, it goes back to the beginning of the company, people don’t leave. And what is it? So let’s talk about what sets them apart. That’s one of the things that stands out to me.
Amy: For me, it really is truly the ownership that the three guys.
David: It’s always the head, it’s always the top guy.
Amy: It really is. It comes from the top down. So you have three guys who grew up together in a small rural town. Two of them are engineers that’s what their degrees were in college. The other a business major and a great salesman and I just think it is such a unique combination to have in the mortgage business, the way they think, the way they approach things. It’s different and but it really is their core values that we have filtered down as a company and we talk about them regularly, tenacity, sincerity, agility, and all of the values that we find important and really you can’t have all those things if you don’t care. And so I think the owners truly care. And they only hire people in management that care and it kind of filters all the way down to our loan originators. You really have to care about your community, care about your customers and just care to make sure you get the job done. So I do think it starts with them and likes do attract likes like minded people do and they have been very fortunate. That when they recognize talent at the ownership level, they go after it. And then that same talent goes after talent that they worked at.
David: Yeah, it’s a self perpetuating thing and it’s when you say they care, it’s what they care about. They care more about the relationship is what I’ve seen. Talk about that from your perspective. Some owners care about, Hey, if you don’t make me money, you’re out of here. So, it’s more, they care about their earnings more selfish in the way they come across where these guys certainly care about earnings and they do well as a company. But there’s something more than that. What is that? More than
Amy: I don’t know if I can put my finger on it, but I can say it in a way that, one of their thematic goals or goals is to touch 25,000 people by 2028 and so that’s not saying we wanna close that amount of loans by 2028. It’s more about people that we touch in the community and how we help people and that’s not always just about achieving home ownership. It’s other things like volunteering through charities and supporting your community when in need when there’s disasters and if you do the right thing and approach things the right way, the business will come. That’s just a benefit of it, I think. So it’s not about throwing out numbers and closed loans all the time. It’s a bigger picture.
David: They care about it because they’re in business to make money and close loans, so they care about it, but it’s how they go about it. There’s something of a unique culture there. You run on the sales side, but you also run the operations and marketing and other aspects of it. How have they steered around the classic ops versus sales? conflict that exists or I guess you’re a part of that now. How have you and the team? I mean with 3AM.
Amy: I can tell you from when my background is heavy opts and I have had sales too. So i’ve got both which is a unique person and for a long time. I lived on the sales side at Alcova but I thrived and was successful because of the opts staff and the way they did care about their sales partners, and we all are one team and there is not a division and so I think that’s, we’re a very sales forward company, and it wouldn’t have a business if you didn’t have your sales and your originators out there and so it’s important to have people in operations and support that care about the customer and the customer is the loan officer and it is the borrower so all coming down to you really have to care at the end of the day about getting a loan closed and making somebody’s…
David: I’m thinking about some of the personalities involved in Alcova. There is a good diversity of personalities there. It’s got the normal popuri of mixture of personalities that in many companies can create conflict, but somehow they navigate those and it’s the culture. How would you describe that when someone is going through and working out. I’m looking again, sharing this from a perspective, what tips others can pick up and take into their company from this conversation.
Amy: I think you have to have different personalities to make things work. We do different assessments with our leadership team on working genius and other things to see where people thrive and where they might have conflict with one another and how to work together on that. So, it is good when you’re working on projects to put people with different perspectives and you got to go into it knowing that I sometimes struggle with this type of personality and their direct approach versus this person needs a softer one. So, we have been for years working in leadership on doing different types of assessments and truly understanding how each person thrives and works and recognizing that and going in, going into projects with that. So it’s almost like we enjoy a little bit of conflict.
David: Yeah, I think if you celebrate it and embrace it. Because it’s going to be there, whether you want it or not, you better figure out how to embrace it and work with it. Talk about some of the assessments. I know I was the one that introduced to them the Six Working Geniuses. I’ll never forget the story. They came to me, go, Dave, we’re frustrated with our operational team because we feel like we’re the only ones always coming up with new ideas and I wish they would come up with more ideas and struck the court is I have this unique thing that I think God created us all uniquely different and are we asking someone to do something that is not equipped to do that? And I think there’s not a better tool than the six working geniuses to find those things that give you life and find those things that suck the life out of you and it’s all different for all of us. And so I introduced that to him and that has been a big game changer for them when they recognize, wait a minute, we have a tendency to be more of the creative build business building aspect and they unconsciously or subconsciously purposely, or less the purpose or just accidentally, they hired people on the other end to be a counterbalance them. So, there’s this good counterbalance between them on the creative side, but they didn’t appreciate the fact that they were created. That’s what gives them life. But that’s what’s asking the opts staff, some of the opts staff to do that, suck the life out of them. When they saw that all of a sudden they relaxed and goes. Oh, you go be you and we’ll be me, we’ll be us, and we’re going to figure out a way and I think there’s valuing these differences and that really gets into the culture. So that’s one of the assessments I introduced. I can speak to what are some of the other assessments that you find that you use that are very valuable, especially when it comes to hiring production people.
Amy: The working genius was one of the best assessments and there was another one we did and I cannot remember the name and you might have to remember, remind me of it because I think it came from you too. It was
David: There’s the Birkman assessment. One of the personality assessments that I really love that. I think we as humans are Rubik’s cubes. I think I refer to as we’re six sided individuals. There’s a love languages or the our appreciation language. There’s our, what motivates us language. There’s our four working personalities, which came out of Hippocrates, which is the disc, the birkman, the Myers Briggs, all of them. They all have that. And I think when we begin to at least show. Interest in those and draw those into our process of hiring. The more insights we can get. It makes for a more successful hire and people don’t leave as a result of that. Especially when you learn to value the things that you don’t have in that.
Amy: Correct, and it’s about respecting each other too.
David: Yeah. It’s that respect. That’s exactly right.
Amy: It was an aha moment to say, okay, what wonder and invention does frustrate me. Like somebody that wants to sit around and wander about something where I want to take more action and galvanize something and but when you have respect for the other person that thinks differently than you do, you learn to step back and let them do their thing. And then you step in when it’s important and you roll.
David: Yo do your role. You do the thing that gives you life and victory.
Amy: Yeah. I do think and I’ve been in this business a long time and been at bigger companies Bank of America where they put us through different assessment types and management workshops And that probably was one of the best that I have ever really the most useful the working genius to me, we recently did a An unreasonable hospitality.
David: I love that book
Amy: That was so amazing because it was just a different perspective with the restaurant industry.
David: Yes But there’s so many parallels. It’s all comes down to creating a customer experience and it’s about the food. But in that case, it was not about the food. It’s a, you gotta have good quality, good product services, roles, food, but it’s creating an experience that made that restaurant’s so unusual.
Amy: Correct. And it was very much in touch with what we’re trying to do because the bar experience is so important to us at Alcova. It really is the customer experience. And so it was just such an aha moment to listen to an industry that is nothing to do with mortgages at all. Not similar at all, but it’s still a service industry and that one was a great one for our leaders because we brought in some of our frontline leaders to that seminar who then they were able to filter it down to the production people, which it does little things can make such a difference. You can institute something small and it makes such a difference.
David: What’s also, which highlights something about 3AM. It’s fun talking behind their back, because I could have so much fun with them and they’re so 3 AM is so uniquely different. Bobby with his sales personality and two engineers, and you got Rob, who’s really quiet. I always say Rob’s participation in a meeting is a thumbs up or a thumbs down. That’s all you get for feedback for the longest time with Rob and then you find out there’s so much in Rob that’s going on very analytical and then Bill Siple, gosh, that guy is just brilliant. He processes things out loud so well and he and Bobby are usually on opposite ends. And we were teasing them about, there’s something we were discussing last week. And we were saying, you know what, I’m going to take Bobby’s position just to annoy Billy, because he’s just always so passioned about what it is, but it really comes to goals. One of the things I want to talk about setting goals, how does Alcova set goals that you find this might be unique and different from how others have gone about that.
Amy: We definitely towards the end of the year in the beginning of the year, get together and set what our word for the year is going to be our thematic goal. It’s more about a philosophy before we set our number goals because that is just such an important thing and it does, it can be a little because usually a goal, you want to look at a number and see results, which we have those goals too. And everybody sets those kind of the same way. But our thematic goal and our word for the year really helps I think continue to drive our culture home to our employees and everybody we work with and what we’re really about.
David: There’s such an important thing to be able to, and you’re talking Patrick Lencioni work from the advantage when you’re talking about thematic goals and all that. You guys are fans of that. One of the things I really enjoy about them is especially Bobby. He is internally just insatiable appetite to learn. He devours more business books than anyone I know and Billy does too and Rob, Rob, I don’t hear as much from him about it, but he’s read every one of the books that they all recommend, but they have are in, have an insatiable appetite to hear and learn about new concepts. How does that filter down through the organization? Does that get annoying when it feels like, okay, so this is the book of the month that we’re studying?
Amy: No, we try to make it fun when we do things like that. If we’re reading a book together and it sounds silly. It can almost be like a book club where we read it together and then we get on a call and we all discuss it and good things always come out of it and even if you can take one little thing. So, it’s important to always try to learn and have a different approach, especially in this business. Our big goal that we’re working on is we want an 8-hour loan approval. We truly believe with all the tools and technology today that are at your fingertips, there is no reason that a loan cannot come in from application and within eight hours that borrower will know that they have been credit approved and that their income and asset and everything is signed off on and we are whittling away at that and we talk about it constantly on calls to our employees and they’re tasked with how can we get there? How can we get there? What can we do better? So it’s just it’s constant trying to get there get the ideas in to get us to this big goal that we ultimately have.
David: Yeah that’s really good. One of the things that I get a chuckle out of them is they getting them to make a decision. Those three, they will kick something around forever. They’re like bringing on a new vendor or hiring somebody. Talk a little bit about, how they do that and how do they collaborate with others? give some thought.
Amy: I’ll say definitely thanks to you and TMS that you’ve put us in touch with some other mortgage companies that we’re able to collaborate with and get ideas and talk about we’re looking at this vendor. We know you’ve used them and how did it go? And we can get great feedback. Plus, you’ve also put some great vendors in front of us too. So, that helps to have trusted people in the business that can make recommendations of course, we have somebody working for us. A young lady, our director of strategic initiatives, and she’s been with Alcova for years, and she’s absolutely brilliant. I have to say, and she definitely likes to go out and find new vendors and tools and she’ll vet them and look at them first. And they’re very good at if you left it up to this young lady and Bobby, they’d want it all right. So you’ve got Billy and Rob slowing everybody down and saying, let’s have some discernment on this and look at it first. So that’s when I’ll come in and the head of our training will come in and other departments and we’ll look at it and make a decision. Is this something that we need? But luckily, because of our relationship with you, David and TMS, we’re able to get good feedback on things. So we don’t tend to waste our time.
David: It is fun. I swear to God there, they have mastered the pregnant pause because I’ll ask them a question and like you and I were having this interactive conversation. If I ask them a question, I’ll never forget when they were interviewing, whether or not to bring me on as their coach and advisor. I would ask him a question and I want to go knock on the glass, on the. Hey, are you guys there? It’s cause it’s like they’re sitting there and it’s like for the longest time, I said, pregnant pause. So I tell anybody that’s interviewing with them, there will be the longest, most sometimes uncomfortable pregnant pauses, but they’re being intentional and thoughtful before they speak, which I probably could learn a little bit from that because I have a tendency, the first thought that comes to me is I’m speaking it out. I think it’s really good. One of the things they talk about, Amy, is they gamify automation and they’re gamifying technology changes. They’re gamifying the things that they’re trying to implement. That has always been a curious term to me and I’ve really tried to get my head wrapped around how people gamify it. I see different people and I’ve never seen it really done well, but it happens, you guys gamify things. Give us an example of that if you could.
Amy: We’re really in a big initiative right now. Where, for example, during our application process, we want our borrower to connect to their assets at application and we use account check for that. And then we want to be able to tap directly into their payroll providers. So, they don’t have to provide pay stubs and w2s and documents to us. We want it to be easy for them so we use you know Argyle for that and then we want to take advantage of all of Fannie and Freddie’s aim and day one certainty validations. We use AI underwriting tool Candor for some of our underwriting as well. So, we’re very heavily automated and to get change and have loan officers because really we need them up front selling and communicating it to the bar where this is important and we want you to use these tools because their borrower were permission tools. For us to make it where a loan officer would want to do it Loan officers need to see things like volume, units, numbers, they like goals like tangible goals So we decided to gamify it and give points. Literally points. So they’ll get what we call impact score points. So to them, it becomes like a game. They’re like ding, ding, trying to hit, all the buttons to get all the points and have all the connections and do all the things right and when they get a certain amount of points, then they can pick a charity of their choice where we’ll contribute to that local charity in their community. So, it becomes a competitive fun game that gets them to buy into the tools and then it also kicks back into the community So that’s just one way that we have gamified trying to get our LOS and loan officers to use, you know some of our tools.
David: You’ve mentioned several times I think this is one of the things that a lot of companies strive to do but struggle to do quite honestly and that is really give back to the communities and I know this is not just something you say you’re going to do, but you guys really go all out at this. Give us a couple examples of what you’re doing and what is that really? does that really convert into sales and impact, so to speak. That has an impact.
Amy: I think it absolutely. It does have an impact on your community when you’re out working in your community and giving to your community and our branch partners to they are on P&L models. So, they have the ability to contribute and do things inside of their community to and with the recent flooding in North Carolina and how heavy that was devastated. Our branch partners, things they did stepped up doing manual labor that they were doing as quickly as they can and we were doing dollar for dollar donations too, trying to give back to the community. Every year in Roanoke we do what we call Park it on the Market, where we give to the school systems and we fill a big school bus full of school supplies. And so some of our branch partners are now doing that too in their local community. But we always celebrate together the things that we’re doing in our community to help. And when people see you out participating in the community they want to do business. They want to see your name and your face and know that you’re a good person and that you’re going to take good care of them. And that’s just the culture here. It’s important to us. So
David: I think there are more and more people are saying, realizing, this is a relationship driven business. It always has been but we sometimes get caught up in the market where rates are we’ve been. So a lot of people really focusing on rates, but at the end of the day, people will do business with people that they know, like a trust and how do we develop that there in your perspective, as we wrap this up, how do you see the markets changing from what you’re seeing? The borrowers is demanding. What is the shift if you could, that you’re seeing, Amy, and how are you guys adjusting?
Amy: You know what’s interesting is I really don’t think it is anything new or different when you when they were doing surveys years ago with consumers and borrowers about what was important to them and what was upsetting to them. They all said the same thing I was having to give too much like I was I was giving so many documents to my loan officer and It was painful. Borrowers don’t want to turn in a W2 or a pay stub or bank statement. They don’t want to dig through their dust drawer and when you look at younger borrowers, they don’t even have those documents. They’re not getting that in the mail and having it in a filing drawer. It really is the market, I think, more than ever, but it’s still where it was, they want convenience. They want the mortgage process to be convenient.
David: A little less painful, a little less complicated, a lot less annoying.
Amy: Correct. And that’s where all of these great tools and technologies are coming into play. Where it really is, it’s at their fingertips and they just need to get permission and we’ll go get it all for you. So I think that What the bar were wants today is really what they wanted a long time ago. We just couldn’t give it to them It was impossible, you know during that time and then it still doesn’t change to it’s people aren’t there this the mortgage business. You’re nervous when you’re getting a mortgage people are nervous and they want to work with somebody they know and trust and who’s going to make them feel supported throughout the process? So that’s where I believe technology will never take the place of the actual the loan officer, that’s just going to help them do their job better.
David: I’ts so good to hear you say that and that’s one of that, one of the things we had talked about talking about in this interview beforehand, but it’s really good to hear you say that, Amy, because I agree with you what worked for me 51 years ago, when I started the industry works and it’s still the number one priority, get me a quick approval and let me have count on that approval and don’t be coming back and asking me so much stuff. It has gotten easier with the work number and Argyle. All the tools we have to pull that access that information. Amy, I appreciate you taking time. You are a busy person and for you to just take a little time out and let’s have a little fun with 3AM and talk about them. I really do admire these guys and what they’re doing and encouraging other people to get to know the company. If people want to reach out to you and they say I’d love to ask her this question, how do they do this? and listeners don’t go out and try to recruit her. She’s loyal as heck. Everyone in their mothers tried to come get Amy. But if they wanted to reach out to you and get some questions and talk to you, Amy, what would be the best way for them to do.
Amy: Sure. They can email me at asmith@alcova.com. And you can give me a call too on my cell number. It’s (757) 646-6240, but I’d love to hear from you.
David: Yeah. Good. Amy, thanks so much for being here with me today.
Amy: Okay. Thank you, David. Have a great day.
David: Appreciate it.
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I have been with ALCOVA since May of 2015. I currently hold the title of Chief Lending Officer over sales, operations and marketing. I started in lending in 1993 when I graduated from college. I have a strong underwriting and management background. ALCOVA was a customer of mine prior to working for them. At one time I was their AE of an investor that they sold loans to. Working in both sales and operations during my career and equally enjoying both is what brought me to ALCOVA. It is important to work for a sales forward mortgage company. I sent several top producing offices to ALCOVA after the market crash in 2008 and they are still here today.