Lykken on Lending

The first half of the Lykken on Lending program will feature our Weekly Updates….to read more info about our regulars and weekly updates go to our website!

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Weekly Updates with Alice, Allen, Matt, Les, and Rob PART 3

It is Monday, May 9th, 2022. We’re thrilled to have you here. Joining me here is Jack Nunnery, my co-host. This show is created by mortgage professionals. It is for mortgage professionals and we’re so grateful to have you as our reader. Our commitment is to bring you timely information that you can read anytime, anywhere. We got Josh Lehr coming on who is Senior Director of Partnerships and Industry Technology at Total Expert.

We had an interesting discussion. He’s going to be bringing his thoughts about the challenges loan officers are facing right now and because of what’s going on in this unusual loan officer recruitment and the impact that all the turnover is having on a lot of companies. Be sure to read the Hot Topic segment. There’s a lot of great information from someone who has seen it from many angles.

I also want to say thank you to the Industry Syndicate. They do a great job of promoting our show along with many others. Check out all the shows on IndustrySyndicate.com. A special thank you goes out to the Mortgage Bankers Association for all that they do for our industry. We also then say thank you to our sponsors, Mortgage Collaborative and Lenders One. Both of these are co-ops. It’s where you co-op together and work in a more intimate setting to share best practices amongst the lenders and also us vendors show up. We then get a chance to connect with the mortgage banking community in a more intimate setting. Check them out. Make sure that you’re still a member, above all else, the MBA.

Also, we have Finastra, which is their Mortgagebot Solution. It does a great job of helping you connect and create an experience that is seamless throughout all the processes. I’m really thrilled to have them as the longest-standing sponsor ever. Also, Total Expert is a purpose-built CRM or customer engagement platform. You need to be paying attention to what Total Expert is doing in the way of automating and expanding this product. It is a leader already in the marketplace, and you are going to know more in this episode why. It’s because of Joe Welu and what he does and who he draws into this company. It is some serious critical leadership that you’re going to benefit from as you read the interview in the Hot Topic segment.

Also, Knowledge Coop, we’re grateful to have them as a sponsor. Check out their new platform. It’s been launched. We are now going to be sharing our show on The Coop. That’s another way you can read this show. Mobility MMI and Modex, both these platforms have intelligence helping you select the right people that you want to recruit that fit with your model. We’re doing a lot of consulting in this area of recruiting right now. There are a lot of interests. You’re going to be reading about that again in the Hot Topic segment, but these two platforms will help you select the ones you want working for your company with the right product mix, geographics, and volume levels. There’s so much information that both of these firms provide in the mortgage industry.

Snapdocs have some amazing tools and they support you in your eMortgage technology initiative. I want to encourage you to check out Snapdocs’ eMortgage Quick Start Program. We do so by going to our website as well as going Snapdocs. SuccessKit does a great job helping your clients create videos that are compelling that talk about their experience with you. It’s quick and easy and so effective.

Also, Lender Toolkit, I’m thinking of Brett Brumley and Brent Embler. These two characters are dear friends of mine. I love what they do at Lender Toolkit. Some of the most innovative things they’re doing fit more in between all the bricks. You’ve got to check out all the various tools and technology that they’ve developed.

FormFree‘s Brent Chandler, it’s so great to have their partnership as well as SimpleNexus. Lori Brewer sold the company to SimpleNexus, and some of the things that they’re doing there are so innovative. Finally, I want to talk about DW Consulting. Debbie Wemyss does a great job in helping your team and your staff create powerful, compelling LinkedIn profiles. It’s so important that you tell your story about yourself and tell it well in that fits with the rest of your company. Check out what Debbie does with her product and consulting. I appreciate it. Also, a special thank you goes out to Rob, Les, Alice, Allen, Matt, and my co-host, Jack Nunnery. Let’s get over to the MBA Mortgage Minute with a report this week from Rob Van Raaphorst.

The latest news from the Mortgage Bankers Association. Last week, the Federal banking agencies released a notice of proposed rule-making on a modernization of the Community Reinvestment Act regulations of note for IMBs during the FDIC board vote on the proposal CFPB Director Rohit Chopra who also sits on the FDIC board, said that CRA should be expanded to non-bank mortgage lenders.

MBA President and CEO Bob Brooksmith stressed MBA’s opposition to this during an interview about the rule last week in the Wall Street Journal. Bob Brooksmith said that the Community Reinvestment Act for independent mortgage bankers is nonsensical and the solution in search of a problem. MBA will continue to oppose both Federal and State efforts to expand CRA to non-banks. That’s it for this week. Thanks for joining me.

Good job, Rob Van Raaphorst. We missed a couple of reports from him and he’s back. We’re so glad to have him. That’s a good reason why you should become a member of the MBA and also get your Mortgage Action Alliance app downloaded. Bob’s pushing back on the CRA component on IMBs because it’s ludicrous what they’re looking at and trying to do. You do not have to be a member of the MBA to get the Mortgage Action Alliance app and have your voice heard. Let’s get over to Les Parker with this week’s TM Spotlight and the macro view of the markets.

The Bears reached 310 before the Bulls reached 210. The US Central Bank launched quantitative tightening. The silver lining to the dead pledge AKA mortgages is that they outperformed treasuries since the Fed meeting. It’s easier for the Fed to sell deep discounted treasuries than mortgages. Additionally, as the crowd expecting a recession in 2023 grows, look for volatility to continue uncomfortably high. It takes some time to lead alone. You’re in the middle of the ride. Powell says, “Everything will be just fine.” This piece is my own. Find hope in the middle of the ride at TMSpotlight.com.

The message is very spot-on. Be sure to sign up for Les Parker’s Newsletter. You can get the paid version for free by putting in the code POWER for a PowerSeller when you sign up. A lot of leaders in the industry are reading Les’ comments every single day. It’s a good critical thought going into that. I recommend that.

Matt Graham, good to have you here with us. Matt Graham is the Founder and CEO of MBS Live. What’s the Market Update, and what do we have on the economic calendar?

Les touched on this stuff going on with the Fed. The big focus was the Fed meeting on Wednesday afternoon and bonds approached that by consolidating at first but not before moving up to the highest yields in quite a while on Monday morning. The market reaction to the Fed was fairly interesting because not a whole lot happened right at 2:00.

The Fed did a good job of delivering exactly what the market expected in terms of the rate hike and the balance sheet normalization plan that has to do with not tapering but the next phase of bond buying reductions. They put caps above and if reinvestments come in, they will continue to reinvest and continue preventing balance sheet runoff. They said in the Minutes in early April 2022 that the cap would be $35 billion and phased in over three months. That means that they have to receive more than $35 billion in proceeds on their bond or MBS portfolio in order to reinvest anything back into the MBS market.

$35 billion basically means no reinvestments in the current environment. It would mean that we’d get a moderate amount of reinvestment when the market picks back up if rates fall. They’re setting it pretty high, and it’s probably going to shut everything down in this environment, but it’s high in order to avoid too much reinvestment going forward. No major surprise. They will start that on June 1st, 2022 and they’re going to take another two months to get halfway there starting in June and then they’ll get the other halfway there in July.

The long end of the bond market took this a lot more poorly than the short end. This is one of the reasons that mortgages were able to outperform. The other reason was that the Fed threw a little bit of a bone to the mortgage market and to the bond market, in general, by saying, “While we are going to be normalizing the balance sheet, there’s a limit to how long we’re going to do that. Once the level of reserves is consistent with what we think is necessary, then we’re going to stop rolling off reinvestments from the balance sheet.”

Mortgage Market Updates: While we are going to be normalizing the balance sheet, there’s a limit to how long we’re going to do that.

Having that bullet point in the normalization principles, which is a document that the Fed releases concomitantly with the announcement and with this news of balance sheet normalization, is something more than we had last time. It’s spelled out that this won’t last forever. The mortgage market particularly was relieved to see that because the mortgage market relies more on the Fed than the treasury market does.

Beyond that, from a curve steepening standpoint, when shorter-dated maturities are doing better than longer-dated maturities, which was the case after Powell’s press conference, it’s a little bit better for mortgages because they’re assumed to be much shorter in duration than ten years for the simple fact that as soon as rates drop 0.5%, everybody that they got a mortgage in the past few months is going to refinance automatically.

There was a varied reaction to the Fed depending on the security. Shorter-dated securities did very well. That’s because there was a specific comment in the press conference where Powell said they’re not considering 75 bps hikes. That Fed rate hike outlook is going to have more of a bearing on shorter-term debt, two-year yields especially, but it also means that 5-year yields will do better than 10s and 10s will do better than the 30s.

Since MBS are closer in duration to fives, that’s one of the reasons they outperformed, but in a general momentum sense for the bond market, what we were left with was a very brief decent reaction on Wednesday afternoon and then more selling pressure like selling in stocks and the long-end of the yield curve. That’s something that analysts and traders scrambled to come up with justifications for, but the yield curve tells the story and it was a factor of normalization being every bps as aggressive as they said it would be and rate hike outlook being perhaps a little less onerous than some people foresaw. It was all about curve trading at that point.

As far as the long end was concerned, everything fell within the trend that had been established long ago. Whether you want to look at that trend as starting in late 2020 or early March in a steeper sense, things have been going up up and away for yields. Thankfully, there’s no major drama. In fact, we’re coming back in the other direction. Some of that may have to do with Asian markets coming back online, specifically Tokyo, which is out on holiday virtually all week. Now, back in the office, I’m not saying that’s why we’re rallying, but there’s more liquidity and activity in the bond market in the overnight session.

Domestic traders have been the best buyers so far and perhaps simply by way of getting back into the office, whereas Friday may have been a little bit of pre-weekend positioning. I wouldn’t be surprised to see things get defensive at times in the next few days as traders gear up for the three 10 and 30-year bond auctions. Also, CPI, with the core component being the most important on Wednesday morning, that’s our big inflation reading.

The Fed explicitly and implicitly said that they’re data-dependent right now. They have a good idea of how much they’re going to hike, stay the course on its normalization thing, and keep an eye on inflation data specifically in order to determine whether they’re going to tighten further or ease up a bit eventually. These inflation reports are tremendously important. CPI probably chip among those, which will be Wednesday morning, the ten-year auction, Wednesday afternoon, and a couple of other inflation indications via producer prices on Thursday. Inflation expectations via consumer sentiment on Friday. They’re all worth watching, starting most importantly with CPI on Wednesday. We’re hoping that data will help us solidify a ceiling, but again, it depends on the data.

Data is so important. It’s critical of what’s out there. There’s a lot to be taken into consideration. What’s the number one thing you think we should be keeping our eyes on?

The CPI will be release at 8:30 AM Wednesday morning. That’s the biggest potential market mover.

Jack, any thoughts on the update from Matt?

I got a couple. First of all, I had to chuckle when Les said that Powell mentioned, “Don’t worry, everything will be all right.” It reminded me of the last time we were in QT and Powell said, “The program is on automatic pilot,” shortly thereafter, S&P 500 tumbled almost 16% over three weeks in December of 2018, causing the Fed to blink. They abandoned rake hikes in January 2019 and started phasing out of QT in March 2019.

I thought, “That reminds me of something similar that Powell said that didn’t turn out to be that way.” I was trying to wrap my brain around the link of QT. What I’m reading is that we’re looking at a shrink of about $3 trillion and at $95 billion a month. My math tells me QT right now is projected to be approximately two and a half years.

It depends on where they set the bar as far as where they want to level off. They may well decide that the level of reserves they need is closer to $2 trillion by the time we’re one year down the road, and then we might be pleasantly surprised when they mention that. As long as the balance sheet is progressively shrinking by a decent clip, I don’t think that they would mind if it took two years per se. I’m not sure there’s a right or wrong timeframe to accomplish that. All they know is that they need to be accomplishing it while they have the chance and that they probably waited too long to start anyway, so here we are.

If the CPI prints at 6%, the markets will react favorably. Anything over 7% could have a negative reaction to it. Matt is spot on with the 8.30% print of CPI on Wednesday, followed by Thursday’s print of PPI. The market right now seems to be wrapped around the axle. It got a little hyper-anxiety going on. A lot of people anxiously await the CPI number on Wednesday.

We shall see. It’s very astute that you made the comment you did. I’d love to get Matt’s feedback on that. They say one thing and then they go, “Marcus and react so well,” What are your thoughts? Remember those days, Matt?

That’s an interesting thing to consider because, to some degree, they have to speak confidently and assumptively, knowing full well that they’ll have to walk things back in the future if the market forces their hand. It is not necessarily as clear as the extent to which they care about stocks, and I hear this a lot. They probably do care if it is filtering through to financial conditions, which is an oddly defined term for the Fed. I don’t pretend to understand what they mean by it, although they do have a little blurb on it if you Google it.

The stocks play into that and also can play into a wealth effect that can affect economic growth as well. At some level, they’re concerned, but first and foremost, they’re concerned about inflation and that they can tolerate a drop in stocks. They were tolerating it in 2018, at least to some extent, because the top in stocks occurred in September 2018. A lot of it was global growth concerns. Those concerns started to filter through to yields in the bond market, and people were thinking, “It looks like this economic cycle is topping out and the Fed has kept rates too high for too long.” Whether it was stocks or not, there was broad economic concern at a global level.

We’ll see the same thing this time around if the economy does what some people expect it to do, whether that’s in response to Fed rate hikes and balance sheet normalization. It’s tougher to say. The Fed policy greased the skids for what the economy would want to do anyway. Now that those skids are ungreased, it’s making it harder to turn the cogs of aggressive growth. If we do have a slowing impulse in the economy, this will add to that. Still, ultimately the global economy is to slow down to the point that inflation is slowing down for the Fed to remove its normalization plan or stop the normalization policy. Inflation first, but then growth jobs and financial stability second.

Mortgage Market Updates: Ultimately, the global economy is to slow down to a point that inflation is actually slowing down for the Fed to remove its normalization plan to stop the normalization policy. So inflation first, but then growth, jobs, and financial stability second.

It’s clearly inflation first. There are so many aspects to this. A market drop is one thing and the bottom is falling out. It felt that in that particular season, what Jack was referring to could bring yet another different reaction. There’s a lot to be determined. You got to have a service like what Matt provides. In fact, I don’t think you need to have one like it. You need to have MBSLive.net. Be sure to sign up. You’ll be asked for a code. You can put in LOL and receive an extended trial period without a credit card required.

You’re going to want to put in a credit card because once you start looking at how good this service is, you’ll want to sign up. Matt, thanks so much for being here each and every week with some great information. Jack, thanks for opining on it as well. Let’s get over to Alice Alvey. Alice is CMB Vice President of Education and Training at Union Home Mortgage. We’re always thrilled to have Alice joining us. She’s got our Legislative Update. Alice, did you have a good Mother’s Day?

I did. I had a wonderful Mother’s Day weekend. It is what we do at our house. That’s pretty cool.

It’s good to have you here. Thanks for dialing in. I know you’re traveling now. I’m so excited to have you here joining us. We always look forward to what you have for us.

Thank you. I was enjoying the conversation about the markets. All I can think of as you guys keep going on about the unwinding and the quantitative tightening is we now have to go through it. At least it’s happening. We went so long that it seemed like we were waiting. We knew this time would come, but no one wanted to be president while this was going on. We can’t keep getting pushed down the road. We’ll see how it goes. I’m glad it’s happening even though it’s painful, but it’s necessary. It’ll be a balancing act.

From my part, Rob Van Raaphorst mentioned in his piece, and it’s in the MBA Advocacy Section of the MBA News link on Mondays about this joint notice of proposed rule-making coming out by the agency. We’ve got the OCC, Federal Reserve, and FDIC issuing this proposed notice. It’s putting out ideas for comments. It’s about 600 pages so it’s going to take a lot of time to digest it.

As you mentioned, the MBA is against this for independent mortgage bankers. We, as independent mortgage bankers, are against the idea of how we would possibly be able to be part of CRA and held to the same standards as a depository because we don’t take the cog community. What we have to watch for in this is the wording.

They’re restructuring the CRA rule and we’re going to be watching closely if, in the restructuring, they’re trying to come up with a way how to do the math for a non-depository institution. Even though they’re saying it’s not part of this round to enforce that it would be a non-depository who would have to follow this, that’s not part of this round. We’re watching closely. Are they trying to take steps closer to that so that, mathematically, it could be done? More to come on that. So far, it looks like it will be okay.

Another interesting bill that I saw got put forward in April. It’s House Bill 7368. It’s titled Transforming Student Debt to Home Equity. There are a lot of these bills. I am waiting to get to the fine print where it’s going to cost somebody money. Somewhere in there, we need an appropriation for billions of dollars, but this didn’t have that. Instead, it was about trying to set up a framework to have a special loan program created by FIFA that is geared towards home purchases in an urban area. It’s trying to revitalize housing in certain markets and giving those with student loans who are paying them on time.

I thought that was a great ad. This isn’t for trying to get out of student loan debt or trying to forgive student loan debt. This was about if I’m paying it back on time and that’s what’s causing me not to qualify. Could we come up with some more lenient underwriting requirements that would allow them to qualify and try to encourage homeownership within some of the urban areas that could benefit from more homeowners looking towards that area?

They introduced a 1% prognosis at this point from gov tracks, but it’s an interesting idea. As we’re all looking for new products to expand in markets, I like this idea. A rep coming out of Ohio put it out there. I’m going to watch that one and see if we can get a new product out there to help our folks with student loan debt get into loans more easily. That’s my report, David.

Good job, Alice. I appreciate it very much. I’m reminding everyone who’s reading this. You can go back and read all of Alice’s weekly updates on this very important topic, the Legislative Update segments, by going to our website. You’ll see everyone’s individual contributions each and every week. It’s very valuable. Alice, thank you so much. I appreciate you joining in, even though you’re traveling on the road. I’m glad to hear you had a great Mother’s Day. Let’s move over to Allen Pollack, who’s here with the Tech Update. Allen, you’re back homes. Did you have a good Mother’s Day?

I did. We treated my wife to a great day, and then all the moms in the family that I know of had a great day as well. How about you, David? Did all the moms and your wife do well?

Nikki and I were talking about us dads. When we get to a certain point that the kids get to a certain age, we go look forward to being empty-nested. Nikki said, “I’m not ready for that.” That’s so true of many moms. Moms are moms. They always want the kids around them and being there. We love our kids, but there is a time when we go, “Fly the coop. It’s time to go.” You’re not that safe. You’ve got three beautiful daughters who are there very much at home. I’m sure your wife is enjoying every moment of it, but it is one of those times.

She’s having a little bit of trouble because my oldest is about to head off to the University of Mississippi. She’s the first one to fly the coop.

Thankfully they come home for the summer most of the time, so that’s good. What have you got for a Tech Update?

As to what Matt, you, and Jack were talking about for the layman or the person that doesn’t understand all of these nitty-gritty details of the market that may be reading this, I’d love some opinion maybe next time Matt or even Jack on what does it mean to someone that never understood how the market movement works, so that would be helpful.

David, based on everything Matt said and the opinion of a homebuyer, they are freaking out. They’re not sure where the rates are, if they’re talking to the right mortgage person or if they should look at their bank. There are technology solutions that are helping originators help borrowers be smarter. We’re looking at the TikTok generation. That’s what they call them now.

The folks who saw their parents struggle with high rates thought everything was great. They have a ton of side hustles and cash. Rates are moving and they don’t know how fast or quick or what’s going on. They all want to buy Airbnbs. Technology, communication, drip campaigns, physical phone calls, face-to-face, now is a time as an originator to truly educate the homebuyer.

I’ve said this a few times, David, “Technology is great.” We love what we do. We’re going to continue to innovate, but there’s nothing like a person-to-person conversation to help someone understand what you have as options and what to do. With that, let’s talk about the user interface. This is a funny joke about where a better user interface could be. I don’t know how many episodes ago where I talked about how there is a hand sanitizing machine that has a very attractive person at the top of the machine with a finger pointing down. Everyone puts their hand to get automatic hand sanitizer where the finger is pointing, but that’s not where the nozzle is to get the sanitizer. That’s a bad user interface. Let’s make sure we’re doing the right thing.

Who has the worst user interface? Elevator. How many times have you gone into an elevator and you cannot un-click the button you already pushed or you don’t have the ability to figure out what floor you’re on or what’s going on? Elevators could use an update. We’re not like elevators, but we can use some innovation.

With that, let’s talk about collaboration. We do not see a lot of technology around co-sharing and co-browsing. That’s something that Zoom is focused on. They released an entire update for Zoom. They’re taking a play at Slack and Microsoft. It’s basically called Zoom United. It has not only an updated whiteboard but easy click button to get to a whiteboard screen. You can draw on any shared thing you’re doing, but now they have omnichannel access, meaning across devices, you have the ability to click and move between those devices. You don’t have to re-log into the meeting from somewhere else, but in addition to that, you can go across all platforms.

The best part about Zoom United is they have a full chat interface. I don’t know if people are going to start jumping off Slack, Microsoft Teams, and all these other platforms, but consider something like that as you collaborate with your vendors and look to provide training demonstrations. A trend I’m seeing on the technology side is people are recording video demos of the things that they’re doing. They’re using Zoom to do that. Think about you have that. You share the screen, you can draw and illustrate or use a highlighter on the screen.

You can save that in segments. You can use them as your training videos for your originators, operational staff, and also externally. Let’s get on the better news. Rocket Pro TPO, with their new technology, they’re saying that on the TPO side, purchase loans will be clear to close in fifteen days or your client, meaning the borrower, will get $2,500 in their pocket. That’s an aggressive push that, “The technology is saving enough money. We’re going to guarantee this. If not, we’re going to put money where our mouth is, but more importantly, as a broker or a third-party originator, fifteen days clear to close is huge.” Is this true or not? I don’t know, but it’s in the news, and I thought I’d share it because it’s cool.

In addition to that, in seven days, loanDepot Mello, which we haven’t heard a lot of news of in the recent while. They’re saying that they now have a digital-first. They’ve got a new technology platform that they’ve continued to innovate on. It’s a digital-first home equity line of credit, and you can get access to funds in as little as seven days. Two big technology plays and both speaking to the market. Think about that as you work on your technology.

Mortgage Market Updates: Two big technology plays, both speaking to the market.

On the real estate side, SoFi and HomeStory partnered together. We all know SoFi is one of the largest FinTech lenders out there. They’ve partnered to deliver what they call SoFi Real Estate Center. It’s brand new and it’s a complete home buying and selling experience. You hear on the radio and TV all the time that “If you work with this company, their technology will help you sell your home faster.” Some say, “You don’t even have to put out the market.” They’re not saying that, but they’re saying they can save you money.

What they can do is help you through the entire home-buying and home-selling experience. If you look at who we’re targeting right now in this industry, that’s SoFi’s customers. It’s a good move on their part. The big news that you’re probably waiting for me to mention is that the Intercontinental Exchange or ICE has entered into a definitive agreement to acquire Black Knight Financial both public companies. The transaction, which is going to be cash and stock, will value Black Knight at $85 a share with a market value of $13.1 billion. Black Knight has about 6,500 employees in Jacksonville, Florida. Tons of people work there.

There are many cool things about this transaction and probably some people can think negative things. Even myself being a LOS vendor and a technology provider, I even like this transaction. Lots of great details, but their cash consideration is $10.5 billion, and expect to be funded with newly issued debt and cash on hand. The stock consideration is valued at $2.6 billion. There’s your $13.1 billion based on ICE ten-day VWAP as of May 2nd, 2022 on $118. There are lots of other amazing details, but the enterprise value is $16 billion, fully synergized 2022 Black Knight adjusted EBITDA.

There are so many places we can go and it’s such a big story. I’m focusing a whole show on it here real soon. I want to talk to you about that, and then also I want to talk to you about conversational AI, another show I want to get going on because I see some things developing. Is it fair to assume that they’re going to go out and raise debt has cost them? The fees to use whichever one of the systems these combined entities have and any new systems they’re going to create are only going to get more expensive. Costs are not going to go down as a result of this. Is that fair to assume?

I’ll give you a partially biased opinion and word on the street. Word on the street is that it’s a difficult opinion. Both are enterprise-valued platforms, but the biased opinion that I have is that it costs more to be on these platforms because they’re big, enterprise, and heavy. You need a lot of configuration and full-time employees to manage them, in some cases not all, and the cost of the vendors goes up because it costs for vendors to be integrated and be part of those platforms.

It doesn’t mean that no other platforms are similar. What it means is that the opinion that I have is that these are expensive platforms. You need to be aligned with your technology plan if you’re going to be on these platforms and be successful compared to being in a situation where it’s managed for you. That’s the differentiator, “How much skin in the game do you have to want to own your process and maintain and support it versus you want to sit back and focus on doing deals?” There’s a lot there to unravel. That’s a very broad opinion and a very quick point.

It’s a very good point and very good stuff. I appreciate you so much. I would like to talk to you as soon as possible about the upcoming shows around some of the themes we talked about. This is going to have many implications. This major merger of two titan giants coming together. They’re going to have a lot of ramifications. We want to dive into that as much of your thoughts on that as possible.

Start thinking about it, Allen. We got to do that real soon. Thank you so much for being here. I appreciate your involvement each and every week. If anyone want to email questions to Allen, do so. It’s Allen@TMS-Advisors.com. Allen, have a great rest of your day. That wraps up this Weekly Mortgage Update. We’re going to be diving into some developments in conversational AI and I’ll explain why when we get into it.

I’m hoping to do that. As things are developing, I see the need to bring back to our audience some interesting technology that’s out there, specifically conversational AI. I’ll talk to you more about it hopefully next time. It’s good to have you with us. I want to say a special thank you to our sponsors, Finastra, Lenders One, Mobility MMI, Modex, The MBA, Knowledge Coop, Mortgage Collaborative, Snapdocs, SuccessKit, Lender Toolkit, Total Expert, FormFree, and Simple Nexus. Thank you so much, everyone, for being here. Have a great week and I look forward to seeing you back here next time.

 Important Links

• Jack Nunnery – LinkedIn
• Total Expert
• IndustrySyndicate.com
• Mortgage Bankers Association
• Mortgage Collaborative
• Lenders One
• Finastra
• Knowledge Coop
• Mobility MMI
• Modex
• Snapdocs
• SuccessKit
• Lender Toolkit
• FormFree
• SimpleNexus
• DW Consulting
• Rob Van Raaphorst
• Mortgage Action Alliance
• Les Parker – LinkedIn
• TM Spotlight
• MBS Live
• Union Home Mortgage
• Allen Pollack – LinkedIn
• Rocket Pro TPO
• loanDepot Mello
• Allen@TMS-Advisors.com